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CEH + CHFI + OSCP

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chippybox

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Post Mon Apr 18, 2011 11:34 pm

CEH + CHFI + OSCP

Hi everyone,

Just passed my CEH today, and am looking at doing the CHFI next.  I'd like to have CEH + CHFI + OSCP in the next 12 - 18 months.

Does anyone have any feedback on the CHFI course?

Anyone done the OSCP?  I've heard that it's nuts - in a really good way.
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venom77

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Post Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:02 am

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

There are a lot of threads that cover both of these topics in-depth. Use the forum search or google
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chippybox

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Post Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:24 pm

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

Wow.  That was unhelpful.

"Hi mate, you're looking for an updated opinion circa 2011 - use google or the forum search to look for old opinions that may not be up to date or relevant".

Seeing as I was after a range of up to date opinions and not a simple how to, your post isn't really much use.
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cd1zz

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Post Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:30 pm

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

Well, BillV is stating the truth. These topics are pretty common on the EH boards. Regardless, I passed OSCP a few months ago and detailed my experience here:

http://networkadminsecrets.blogspot.com ... ified.html

There are a number of other folks who have also detailed their experiences in the last 6 months or so.
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hayabusa

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Post Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:50 pm

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

chippybox wrote:Wow.  That was unhelpful.

"Hi mate, you're looking for an updated opinion circa 2011 - use google or the forum search to look for old opinions that may not be up to date or relevant".

Seeing as I was after a range of up to date opinions and not a simple how to, your post isn't really much use.


So wait...  You want to be in IT security, but take offense to people telling you to search an IT security-related forum?  When OSCP tells you to 'try harder', you'll be in for a rude wake-up.  Not trying to be mean, so don't take it that way, please.  But a fast search here WOULD have yielded you pretty current results.  So rather than immediately going on the offensive, I'd highly suggest you check ego at the door, and learn from this.  BillV's reply was short and to the point.  Spend some time here, and you'll learn he IS here to help, as are many of us, who might well have given you the same advice. 

It'd be different if you first looked, then asked.

Anyway, welcome, and I hope you feel more positive about future experience and research, here.
~ hayabusa ~ 

"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


OSCE, OSCP , GPEN, C|EH
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venom77

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Post Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:25 am

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

chippybox wrote:Wow.  That was unhelpful.

"Hi mate, you're looking for an updated opinion circa 2011 - use google or the forum search to look for old opinions that may not be up to date or relevant".

Seeing as I was after a range of up to date opinions and not a simple how to, your post isn't really much use.


You will find plenty of recent, relevant information on the topics you're looking for in these forums. Try looking on the boards of the specific certifications.

Example OSCP Search

Google has a feature that lets you filter results by date (try 'past month').
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chippybox

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Post Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:17 pm

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

hayabusa wrote:
So wait...  You want to be in IT security, but take offense to people telling you to search an IT security-related forum?  When OSCP tells you to 'try harder', you'll be in for a rude wake-up.  Not trying to be mean, so don't take it that way, please.  But a fast search here WOULD have yielded you pretty current results.  So rather than immediately going on the offensive, I'd highly suggest you check ego at the door, and learn from this.  BillV's reply was short and to the point.  Spend some time here, and you'll learn he IS here to help, as are many of us, who might well have given you the same advice. 

It'd be different if you first looked, then asked.

Anyway, welcome, and I hope you feel more positive about future experience and research, here.


Thank you for the welcome, and your response.

I did look first, and then asked.  In hindsight, the problem was most definitely my fault and I think lies in my question and how it was worded.

My actual question should have been:

"Do people think there is much point in doing the CHFI if I have CEH and plan to get OSCP?"

While I could find peoples experiences in doing CEH, CHFI, and OSCP individually, and some threads about CEH and OSCP, i couldn't really find a definitive answer as to whether or not the CHFI would be worth my time (and my works money) if I planned on jumping in to the OSCP anyway.

I get that the CHFI is more the other side of the coin, but I figure the OSCP will leave me thinking in a different way about IT security and some of the stuff in CHFI will be intuitive just from all the work that goes into OSCP.  Maybe I'm wrong.  Who knows.

In regards to this:

hayabusa wrote:When OSCP tells you to 'try harder', you'll be in for a rude wake-up.  Not trying to be mean, so don't take it that way, please.


I don't take it as rude at all and understand your point.  The above quote is the nice version of how I get treated by my mentor/s at work every day, so I'm not particularly concerned about that side of OSCP.  Hearing "Shut up.  Work it out yourself" from your boss most of the time prepares you a little for that sort of thing.

hayabusa wrote:You want to be in IT security, but take offense to people telling you to search an IT security-related forum?


No, not offense. I didn't mean to be offensive either.  I just meant to be straight to the point.  The thing that irked me was my perception of the tone in the message. 
BillV wrote:There are a lot of threads that cover both of these topics in-depth. Use the forum search or google


I read it as "You're annoying me and I couldn't even be bothered wasting my time with a hello.  Sod off and go use the search function instead of wasting our time"
Like I said, my perception of tone.  Forums (and emails) can get that way sometimes.  I'll take it as my fault.

hayabusa wrote:
check ego at the door



Not quite sure what you mean.  My self importance is not wrapped up in this.  As I have outlined above, there was some errors in my perception of the original response, and the initial question i asked.  It's not relevant to bring my sense of self esteem into question or map out my psyche based on two forum responses.

cd1zz wrote:Well, BillV is stating the truth. These topics are pretty common on the EH boards. Regardless, I passed OSCP a few months ago and detailed my experience here:

http://networkadminsecrets.blogspot.com ... ified.html



Thanks. I have had a browse through prior to this thread being started your blog and read that particular post once or twice.  It's a good review of OSCP, but doesn't answer the question (that I didn't ask properly).

BillV wrote:
You will find plenty of recent, relevant information on the topics you're looking for in these forums. Try looking on the boards of the specific certifications.

Example OSCP Search

Google has a feature that lets you filter results by date (try 'past month').


Thanks BillV.  My Apologies
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hayabusa

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Post Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:35 pm

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

Ahh ok.  Given your re-wording of the original request, it makes a bit more sense.  We didn't intend our replies as attacks, as you've come to understand, so I'm glad that's past us, now.

While I don't have CHFI, I can certainly see how you might find value in it, prior to OSCP.  Personally, it's on my list, but really, if your instructors are good, and you focus on the hacking side well, I actually think, you'll learn CHFI better AFTER you have better understanding of attack concepts.  Opinions on this may vary, and it may vary by person learning, too.  But to me, forensic thinking is easier when I already have a mindset of how someone might do something (obfuscation for instance,) making me look at the other avenues.

I may have more thoughts later, as I am working tonight, and don't have much spare thought in me :-p, but I'm sure others will chime in, now that the need /request is better clarified.
~ hayabusa ~ 

"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


OSCE, OSCP , GPEN, C|EH
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venom77

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Post Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:21 am

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

I read it as "You're annoying me and I couldn't even be bothered wasting my time with a hello.  Sod off and go use the search function instead of wasting our time"
Like I said, my perception of tone.  Forums (and emails) can get that way sometimes.  I'll take it as my fault.


It was more like "We get asked this question almost daily, you're sure to find the answer in a thread that already exists. Myself, and others, have already answered the same, or very similar, questions and my response most likely remains the same."

My actual question should have been:

"Do people think there is much point in doing the CHFI if I have CEH and plan to get OSCP?"


Had that been the initial question my response would have varied, and went more like this...

You would be better off to go to the OSCP first before going to the CHFI. It's been a little bit of time since you did the CEH course (Sept. '10) but you've certainly been studying the objectives and material to prepare for the exam you've just taken and passed. While that information and material is fresh in your head, and you have the 'attacker' mindset, it would probably be in your interest to pursue the OSCP before the CHFI as they focus on two different areas. EC-Council, and probably most people, recommend CEH before CHFI because you should know the attack vectors before doing the forensics side. In short, the CHFI is not really going to help you with OSCP as it doesn't directly align with the subject matter but the CEH is a good lead into it.

As for a point in doing CHFI at all, that's up to you and what you want to do with your time/money/career.
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chippybox

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Post Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:43 am

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

BillV wrote:
Had that been the initial question my response would have varied, and went more like this...

You would be better off to go to the OSCP first before going to the CHFI. It's been a little bit of time since you did the CEH course (Sept. '10) but you've certainly been studying the objectives and material to prepare for the exam you've just taken and passed. While that information and material is fresh in your head, and you have the 'attacker' mindset, it would probably be in your interest to pursue the OSCP before the CHFI as they focus on two different areas. EC-Council, and probably most people, recommend CEH before CHFI because you should know the attack vectors before doing the forensics side. In short, the CHFI is not really going to help you with OSCP as it doesn't directly align with the subject matter but the CEH is a good lead into it.

As for a point in doing CHFI at all, that's up to you and what you want to do with your time/money/career.


You're right - it has been a bit of time since doing the course, but having the attacker mindset is part of my role at work.  I have been working in the field since Dec 09, so am across the material reasonably well considering that I am in a junior position.

I'm pretty excited about the OSCP to be honest.

The CHFI was more of an offer from the training company at a discounted price.  In the days since initially writing this post, I've done some more research and got a bit more rounded advice.  I think I'll steer clear of the CHFI and go for the CCE instead, but I'll do it after the OSCP. The fact that the CHFI is multiple choice has really made me want to avoid it.  Maybe I'll just sit the exam after I've done the CCE, and avoid the massive price tag for the CHFI training.

Pen Testing is much more part of my role than forensics, but I will be performing more investigations in the future, and I would like to have that certification tucked under my belt as well.
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venom77

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Post Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:48 am

Re: CEH + CHFI + OSCP

Cool. Enjoy and good luck with OSCP. It's a fun course with an extensive lab that you're sure to have a good time with.

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