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Course/ Cert comparison

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SephStorm

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Post Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:16 pm

Course/ Cert comparison

Hi all,

I was just thinking, I think it would be useful to have a thread, mainly for reference, with comparison reviews, information regarding the different certs/courses that this forum deals with.

It looks like the most common courses are the CEH, the Mile2 line of certs (with their ever changing names), Hacking Dojo,  eCPPT, OSCP, and GPEN.

Can we get a one thread comparison? Pro's Cons, experience requirements and any other relevant knowledge?
sectestanalysis.blogspot.com/‎
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lorddicranius

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Post Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:48 pm

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

I'd like to second this request :)  I'll contribute a few links that I've saved in a document while trying to create a "career education plan."


A few reviews I've found very helpful in determining which courses/certs I want to aim for.
GSEC, eCPPT, Sec+
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sil

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Post Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:38 pm

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

Here's my fave so far... RWSP

http://www.blackhat.com/html/bh-us-11/t ... ldSec.html (RWSP @ Blackhat July 2011)

http://www.peaksec.com/preset-1/whois/98.html (cert proctors home page)

https://www.infosecisland.com/blogview/ ... ation.html (mirror @ infosec island)
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lorddicranius

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Post Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:14 pm

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

Still learning all the ins and outs of the website here, but I found some articles pertaining to certs the forum deals with, although it looks like it could use some updating (missing certs) - the "certifications" link at the very top of the page.  This could be a great place to add links to reviews that others have found helpful.
GSEC, eCPPT, Sec+
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cd1zz

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Post Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

sil

Can you talk a little about the BH class you mentioned? How long is it? How is it setup? Is it just a big lab with attackers and defenders? Sounds really cool.
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SephStorm

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Post Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:56 am

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

Please feel free to answer those questions.

So far we have the eCPPT, the OSCP and the RWSP. The great thing about these providers is that their material, probably not intentionally, builds on the knowledge learned at the previous level.

So far we have:

(Throwing this in here) CEH: Ec-Council- An entry level hacking cert. This course teaches the basic methodology of the hacking process and the tools to succeed in those endeavors. I have looked around, and I see no other cert that is suggested as an intro to hacking, higher level courses require this knowledge, even if it is included in said course. Certification requires a traditional exam.

eCPPT:elearnsecurity (I forgot to mention the companies previously)- A mid level certification that offers training in Network Security, Systems Security and Web Application Security. Prerequisites: Based on reviews, and my free SQL injection module preview, I would suggest that someone interested in this course be familiar with coding on some level. Some may disagree with me, but just looking at the content of two of the modules, you have malware coding, shellcoding, and SQL injection. Certification requires a traditional exam and a hands on practical

OSCP: Offensive Security- An advanced level program that requires the true hacking spirit. You are expected to have prior knowledge, and is a tough hill to climb. Prerequisites: Command of Linux, programming/scripting experience, and perseverance. Certification requires a hands on examination.

RSWP: Sounds like the top tear at the moment, the CISSP of real security perhaps? An advanced program that requires the ability to not only attack a target, but to defend against attacks. Prerequisites:Knowledge of Windows or Linux, networking, and at least basic hacking. Thats the official line, My guess, based on review 2 above is that you should have mastered the techniques, and theory learned at the previous levels. Certification consists of a Hands on course, followed by an exam and thesis.

Any others? Comments?
sectestanalysis.blogspot.com/‎
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cd1zz

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Post Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:09 am

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

oops, I missed Sil's second link. RWSP sounds gnarly.

That makes OSCP look like childs play.
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sil

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Post Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:09 pm

Re: Course/ Cert comparison

cd1zz wrote:oops, I missed Sil's second link. RWSP sounds gnarly.

That makes OSCP look like childs play.



RWSP was difficult for a few reasons. 1) The attack vectors weren't run of the mill Windows 2000, 2003, NT machines. They were mainly Windows 2008 servers, hardened Linux machines, etc 2) Whatever you were attacking, your attacks had to be stealth. During the exam, the opposing team was watching and countering what you did 3) You had to think outside of the normal box...

When I was doing the recon phase of the blackhat part of the exam, I fired off many decoys at my opponents and had those decoys running continuously. I did this because I was on the defending side the first day around. I saw what the opponents did when THEY tried to "pwn my team" and I saw how easy it was to detect them.

From my POV, I didn't have it in my budget to buy a firewall nor would my manager allow it. "WTF are you talking about..?" The premise of the exam were you were corporate defenders with a budget and a set of real life rules. My managers wouldn't approve of a "block all" rule to defend myself. The reasoning was because it would affect e-commerce. Since they wouldn't allow this rule, (block in) I decided to use budget money to purchase "block OUT" rules.

Block out rules? Sure... Just because I need to allow e-commerce in, should not mean I should allow SSH OUT from a webserver. So I purchased my block OUT rules to slow them down via their subnet. From the offensive side, I had to make quick visios to understand what it is I was protecting and why...

Now back to the offense... I needed to make sure I was a needle in a haystack during my attacks. So what I did was fire off decoy scans every time I did something. This enabled confusion for those "watching out for me." Someone on the opposing team "swore" he saw me coming in and opted to use budget money to block an attacker... Bad move, he didn't diagram his network and ended up blocking his own connections which cost his team points...

This is what I mean thinking outside of the box... Now... The difference between this exam and say the OSCP is, you weren't given any information on offense or defense. You walked into a classroom for two days. Day one offense, day two defense (or vice versa). You had one of two objectives: own or protect. The targets were NOT static targets, you actively had to deal with people locking down machines while you were attacking. When I posted my firewall rule, someone had a partial pivot into my network... Followed by fail.

The exam helps you think outside of the box and work with people as a team. It enables you to see how others operate via sharing information, tactics and techniques. I wouldn't particularly take the exam without experience. I JUST finished up signing the NDAs and other stuff for the RWSP, months after I've taken it. Was one of my favorite classes and definitely my personal favorite certification. I also happened to win the silver coin MVP for my team, so I was hyped. Wish I could do it again

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