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Ps_107
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« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2011, 06:08:07 PM »

No worries about taking the time to respond. 

We're here to help one another learn.  Sometimes, folks take posts the wrong way (aka - another of my responses, today, drew fire.)  They're rarely intended negatively, but they're generally brutally honest, so sometimes I (and others) have to double-check wording, to make sure the point is made without offending or scaring someone.

Anyway, if you have further questions, that's what we're all here for.  Learning and info-share.

Have a great day!

I'm a brutally honest kinda guy too, so I know exactly where you're coming from. Smiley

Thanks again bro.
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Ps_107
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« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2011, 06:11:52 PM »

If I go to Starbucks or the airport, or really anywhere that has an open network, I'll forward all of my traffic through an SSH tunnel to my home network. That way it just looks like encrypted traffic on the public network, but I still have to rely on the security of my home network to make sure my data is safe. Tongue

I don't quite know what all of that means, but when I figure it out, I just might give it a try.  Thanks. Smiley
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hayabusa
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« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2011, 07:20:50 PM »

Means he has an ssh server setup at home, and tunnels all of his traffic back, through that, rather than directly browsing over his hotel internet IP address.  Other ways might be setting up a vpn server at home (same principal for tunneling your traffic,) and connecting through that.  In essence, it makes all of your browsing appear to originate from your home IP address, as well as making your home network gateway and security measures work, for your remote / hotel / coffee shop connection.
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"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


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« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2011, 11:31:14 AM »

Thank you very much for all of the helpful information you've provided me. 

You said, "When I am traveling I tend to VPN into my home network before I do anything.", I'm a little confused.  I thought a VPN could only be accessed in other public locations other than your own home.. (such as a business complex or maybe even a library).  I'm probably just missing something though, so would you mind explaining how to VPN your own "home network" without being in a business complex and the like?

Other than that, I'm definitely going to take everything you've said into consideration.

I have a home server running a couple different virtual appliances.  One is a virtual OpenVPN server.  OpenVPN allows you to have a single free VPN (virtual private network) connection.  You can pay for it and get additional connections.  There are some decent documents from them on how to setup both server and client.  There are also a number of services you can subscribe to for a VPN but again you don't have control of the provider so it is not 100% secure.  It probably is more secure than using the straight "Free" wi-fi at whatever coffee shop, airport or bookstore has available.  The reason you don't see VPNs used in a more personal level is sometimes due to the cost of the devices that support them.  Typically small/medium businesses have a higher end firewall that supports VPN and they use an internal server for authentication means.  Those of us in the IT realm tend to have home networks that can support a similar setup and since we are the only users, we are only affected when it is down.

For you I would recommend implementing a server for both your file storage and use of RADIUS authentication for a VPN solution supported through your firewall.  That way when you travel you can VPN into your home office for file access and more secure communications.

Glad I can help!
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hayabusa
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« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2011, 12:19:31 PM »

If you're looking for a 'free' solution, too, I THINK the freeware version of Untangle has VPN, as well.
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"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


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« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2011, 10:44:03 PM »

Thank you again to all of you who've been kind enough to make a contribution to my inquiries.

I've done as much research as I possibly could (so far) on just about everything you've all suggested.  I'll more than likely have to put a little more time into understanding all of the minute intricacies of you guys' responses.

Although the majority of what you've all given me sounds pretty complex at the moment (at least from my perspective), it's still fascinating nonetheless.

If you all don't mind, I do have some more questions in regards to security however.. most of which might come across as sounding pretty ignorant but I hope you'll bare with me.

1)  Does a Penetration Tester need to physically be in-front of their clients CPU in order to perform a successful Penetration Test?

2)  If not, would the outcome of a Penetration Test still be as thorough and effective if let's say the Tester performed their tasks while being in a totally different location than their client?

3)  I understand that a computer system can get so jacked-up that a hacker could actually end-up "owning" the victims computer and have total control over it.  So, let's say I hired a Penetration Tester who just so happened to be in some far-off distant land like Kansas and let's just pretend that I lived in Seattle.  Would my hired Tester from Kansas be able to detect someone who was actually "owning" my system and then be able to actually kick them off of it, and then patch-up my systems vulnerabilities afterwards?

Note:  I'm well aware that a Pen-Tester could do all of that while in the physical presence of the infected computer system.  I'm curious however if they'd actually have the same effect by testing the computer from another location.

Thank you for your patience.
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« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2011, 09:03:32 AM »

Ps_107

It all depends on the scope of the project.  There are internal and external tests and both come with their own scope of work.  But lets take a step back for a second.  Penetration tests are not cheap (if you stick with a reputable company).  If you are currently a single person environment with no server at the moment.  Then a penetration test is not really something you need. 

I would suggest brining in an IT consultant in your area who is familiar with the needs of a small business client to assist in your setup.  This also holds a cost but it is much less than a penetration test.  We usually schedule a test when we know we have done all we can to secure our systems and want to see how we do.  It also helps us in deciding where we need to improve more and budget that accordingly.

Don't get too paranoid with securing a network that may or may not exist.  Figure out what you want to do with the network and work on securing it based on that.

Lets say I was building a new network for a small business < 5 workstations and MAYBE a server.  For less than 5 people I would probably not waste money on an inhouse server.  I would probably look to something like Amazon Cloud services or Google Apps depending on what your industry is.  If you are a one man shop, you can keep the costs down by using online resources for email and storage.  Ensure they solution supports SSL based access as well as encryption for storage, or you can simply encrypt the data afterwards. 

Again all this is really based on your industry and your business plan.  If you don't like keeping your stuff up on the internet, then at least utilize it for backups.  Keep in mind the larger the chunk of data you are backing up, the longer it will take to restore.  I like to recommend backing local up on an external drive and copying that to an online backup solution such as Carbonite. 

If you do not keep any resources in house, then you can easily lock down your firewall device so only the necessary ports are allowed out and nothing is allowed in.  Utilize 15+ character passwords using mixed case, numbers and special characters and keep services such as Windows 7's User Access Control (UAC) enabled.  That is the box that pops up when you try to install something even though you are an local admin, it still requires the OK to proceed.

Keep it simple stupid is what I like to say.  You can only lock down so much before it impacts your business.  In this day and age you need to have an internet presence, twitter account and hell even facebook to an extent because that is where you will find the business.  For all that you need to be online in some fashion.  Just practice safe use and you are as protected as you can be.
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Ps_107
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« Reply #22 on: November 03, 2011, 02:41:17 PM »

Ps_107


Keep it simple stupid is what I like to say. 

Sometimes, it isn't quite that simple.

If you only understood the gravity of my situation, I think you'd have a better appreciation for all of the inquiries I've made thus far.

So let's take a step forward.  Could you please elaborate on what you meant when you said, "It all depends on the scope of the project.  There are internal and external tests and both come with their own scope of work."?
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hayabusa
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« Reply #23 on: November 03, 2011, 05:06:09 PM »

With regard to scope...

All project and pentests need to be 'clearly' defined / scoped.  What is and isn't off-limits?  What processes and systems are to be tested?  Is it a website- only test, or are you to test perimeter routers and gateways?  Is social engineering in the scope?  What hours is the testing to be done, during?

The list goes on, and on, and on...

But it all needs clear definition, so that you don't overstep authority, or break systems that you're not supposed to affect.
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"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


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« Reply #24 on: November 03, 2011, 07:22:22 PM »

With regard to scope...

All project and pentests need to be 'clearly' defined / scoped.  What is and isn't off-limits?  What processes and systems are to be tested?  Is it a website- only test, or are you to test perimeter routers and gateways?  Is social engineering in the scope?  What hours is the testing to be done, during?

The list goes on, and on, and on...

But it all needs clear definition, so that you don't overstep authority, or break systems that you're not supposed to affect.

So would a Pen-Tester be able to obtain a clear definition for someone cracking into a system while maliciously distributing personal information all over the internet?

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eth3real
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« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2011, 07:31:34 PM »

Ps_107, are you saying that someone has taken control of your computer, gained access to your personal information, and is spreading that information out on the internet?

I would advise running Wireshark on your computer while in use to see if there's any strange traffic. Maybe even install an IDS on your network, just to see if anything is picked up. There's a turnkey solution called Insta-Snorby that may do the trick.

If you do in fact have an attacker active on your system, then there are a lot of extra steps you need to take.
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« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2011, 08:06:18 PM »

Ps_107, are you saying that someone has taken control of your computer, gained access to your personal information, and is spreading that information out on the internet?

I would advise running Wireshark on your computer while in use to see if there's any strange traffic. Maybe even install an IDS on your network, just to see if anything is picked up. There's a turnkey solution called Insta-Snorby that may do the trick.

If you do in fact have an attacker active on your system, then there are a lot of extra steps you need to take.

Thank you very much for your recommendation Eth3real.

I've still gotta learn how to use it properly but I feel a little better knowing that I've got some sort of reliable security on my computer other than "Norton."

I've gotta go so I'll continue this message a little bit later on.

Thanks again.
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« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2011, 09:21:09 AM »

Understandable Ps_107.  And yes I do not know your situation.  As we all have a wealth of information behind us, we can only speculate at what you are ultimately trying to do and protect.  I do understand your hightened awareness due to past issues.  If you have intellectual properly that needs protecting, you should also insure you have some legal protection going forward with your new project.  I understand the costs involved with protecting intellectual properly could be high, but so are penetration tests. 

In most cases a Pen tester is not looking for other people breaking in, but looking for a way in themselves and telling you about it after.  The goal of the pen test could vary from simply breaking the perimeter to obtaining access to critical company data.  But it is all in the scope.

I would highly recommend you create a relationship with a local IT firm that can better understand your situation and recommend a solution that will best suit you.  We can only speculate and rather than give you information overload, it is much easier to make recommendations and answer your questions when we actually know what needs protecting.  Obviously I am not asking you to divulge that information to us.  But working with someone directly may give you better answers than posting on a forum.  If anything you can always pass the recommendations by us and hear our opinions on them. 

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hayabusa
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« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2011, 10:02:24 AM »

Agreed with 3xban.

It almost sounded, from your last reply, Ps_107, that you're thinking more in terms of a CHFI (Hacking Forensics), rather than an ethical hacker/ penetration tester.  There are occasions when a person will do both, but more often, there are those that specialize in each area, and you'd be best served, as 3xban noted, in talking to someone closer to you, who might be able to advise you which route you're really looking to pursue.

Good luck, and keep us posted.
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~ hayabusa ~ 

"All men can see these tactics whereby I conquer, but what none can see is the strategy out of which victory is evolved." - Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War'


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« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2011, 09:58:15 PM »

Understandable Ps_107.  And yes I do not know your situation.  As we all have a wealth of information behind us, we can only speculate at what you are ultimately trying to do and protect.  I do understand your hightened awareness due to past issues.  If you have intellectual properly that needs protecting, you should also insure you have some legal protection going forward with your new project.  I understand the costs involved with protecting intellectual properly could be high, but so are penetration tests. 

In most cases a Pen tester is not looking for other people breaking in, but looking for a way in themselves and telling you about it after.  The goal of the pen test could vary from simply breaking the perimeter to obtaining access to critical company data.  But it is all in the scope.

I would highly recommend you create a relationship with a local IT firm that can better understand your situation and recommend a solution that will best suit you.  We can only speculate and rather than give you information overload, it is much easier to make recommendations and answer your questions when we actually know what needs protecting.  Obviously I am not asking you to divulge that information to us.  But working with someone directly may give you better answers than posting on a forum.  If anything you can always pass the recommendations by us and hear our opinions on them. 



I've already started looking into a couple of IT firms but actually developing a relationship with them is a whole other thing.

Other than that, that's a great idea and I'll do whatever I can to get any of those guys to help me out.
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