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You are here: Home arrow Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certificationsarrow General Certificationarrow Securityarrow The value of GSE
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Author Topic: The value of GSE  (Read 15049 times)
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H1t M0nk3y
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« Reply #15 on: October 13, 2010, 06:57:31 AM »

Wow, thanks What90!!

I didn't know there was a GSE amongst the EH.net members. I appreciate the time you took to reply to my post.

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The GSE is a long term goal, rather short to mid-term one, so by all means take and excel in CEH/CISSP/CISA/GPEN/OSCP/CCNA etc, but once you completed them it is great to have somewhere else to aim for

I understand now. GSE is something you consider once you have done many, many other things. So yes, it is worth it big time, but not when you start. The goal is simply too high when you are new to the IT security field. But as you said:
Quote
The people taking the GSE with me were a very diverse group. The only real definition I would place on them is they are all driven, seasoned security professionals with a desire to test and push themselves.
GSEs are all experienced guys (but I already knew that!).

So again, thank you What90 for your answer to my questions. I understand the motivation now.
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ziggy_567
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« Reply #16 on: October 13, 2010, 08:54:21 AM »

Wow! Congratulations!!!

I have to say, too, that I really appreciate your blog, Chris! I won't attempt the GSE for some time, but it is a long-term goal of mine.
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Ziggy


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steven1664
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« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2010, 01:39:34 PM »

This whole conversation got me interested in looking at DoD 8570 as far as the value of the GSE in the government sector.  I had to laugh when I saw the GCIH listed as a certification that will qualify someone for IAT Level III certified according to the government because also listed under the IAT Level III section................GSE.  Who writes these documents cmon the GCIH is held to the same standard at the GSE, do those people have any clue about certifications at all.  If they just looked at the website for three seconds about the GSE they would realize it is not just one test involved in it and that the GCIH is normally included in the track for GSE.....sorry I just needed to rant about our tax dollars at work.
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ziggy_567
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« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2010, 02:03:19 PM »

I'm not trying to be a smart@55, but where would you have them put the GSE?

Level III is as high as it goes. If GCIH qualifies you at level III, then GSE certainly would.
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steven1664
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« Reply #19 on: October 13, 2010, 05:33:30 PM »

ziggy no offense taken.  I realized that when I wrote that post maybe it didnt come out the same way as I thought in my head.  I was just saying that I think it is dumb that GCIH qualifies someone at Level III.  If anything it should be at level 2.  GSE should definitely be level 3 it is a very hard time consuming process and costly process to get GSE certified.

It just seems weird to me that according to 8570 GCIH and GSE are held essentially at the same level of expertise if you know what I am saying essentially they are looked at as carrying equal weight, because they both qualify you for the same level for the government.

I was just saying that I thought that was really jacked up that GCIH was level 3 along with GSE since there may be different routes to get a GSE, but all of them require that you have the GCIH certification.
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What90
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« Reply #20 on: October 14, 2010, 12:36:14 AM »

Hello H1t M0nk3y,

I hope that over the next few years there will be a ever-growing number of EH-ers with the GSE to their names.

Thanks ziggy_567, if I can help out with the ascent to the GSE, let me know :-)
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hell_razor
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« Reply #21 on: October 14, 2010, 08:40:29 AM »

steven1664 - I think the problem with your thinking on GSE being Level III, is that there are only 29 GSEs worldwide.  They have to fill more than 29 positions, so they have to have a fallback.  Perhaps a combination of a couple of certs would be more to your thinking, though?
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bongk
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« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2010, 10:43:56 PM »

Hey All,
What90's not the only GSE holder here.
Though honestly I don't browse the forums often. 

In my opinion -
If I were seriously job searching I would get the CISSP too, I think my resume hits the HR person's cylindrical file pretty often because they don't see CISSP and don't know GSE.  I'm considering taking the CISSP in march for just this reason.  I have found if I make it past the stupid HR filter and have a chance to explain what the GSE is to the hiring manager it seems to give me a pretty strong leg up over other candidates.

The other great thing about the GSE is it keeps all your other certs current. I just renewed all of my GIAC certs by taking one exam last month.

Some other humble opinions -
Cost wise, if you are starting from nothing I can see it would be pretty expensive.  If you already have the certs to qualify to sit for the test its definitely worthwhile.

Difficulty-wise, its tough but very fair.  If you memorized the material but don't understand it you'll struggle.  If you understand what's going on in each and every page of the GSEC, GCIH, and GCIA courseware, including the labs, then the GSE is something you can pass.   There's an essay I put together at sans.edu with more info if you haven't seen it :
http://www.sans.edu/programs/gse_prep.php

Kevin
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H1t M0nk3y
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« Reply #23 on: October 15, 2010, 06:34:20 AM »

Thanks bongk/Kevin for your post. I just  finished reading your essay and it gave me an idea on what GSE is all about.

Now we have 2 GSE out of 29 on this forum. Anyone else?
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dougburks
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« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2010, 05:36:18 AM »

I took the GSE exam along with What90 (Hey Chris!) and I would agree with everything he said.  I would also agree with bongk that you should get the CISSP as well. 

In my case, I did the CISSP first (back in 2006) to go ahead and get it out of the way.  Then, I started working on my SANS certs.  I started with SANS 503: Intrusion Detection because that's what I was most interested in at the time.  I then wrote a Gold paper for 503.  Since I knew I wanted to work towards the GSE and SANS 401: Security Essentials was the first prerequisite, I took it next.  Then, I took SANS 560: Penetration Testing and finally SANS 504: Incident Handling. 

For those that are looking for ways of reducing the cost, I would suggest looking at the SANS Mentor program.  Not only is mentoring a great way of forcing yourself to understand the material at a deeper level, but they also have the Triple-8 program which allows you to qualify for free training. 

To anyone who is considering the SANS GSE, you can do this!
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ziggy_567
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« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2010, 08:38:23 AM »

@dougburks:

Can you elaborate on the Triple-8 program? I've never heard of this...
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Ziggy


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dougburks
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« Reply #26 on: October 19, 2010, 12:19:09 PM »

Here's the Triple-8 description from SANS:

"Earn the “Triple 8 Award” by Teaching 8 students while Scoring 8.8 on Student Evaluations
-Mentor a class with 8 students with scores above 8.8 and receive a complimentary SANS class via @Home, Mentor or OnDemand, including the GIAC certification!
-Earn the award a second time and you get the option of a free SANS Conference Seat! (travel not included)
-Agree to come back and teach additional Mentor class within 6 months of completing first class."

This definitely helps cover the cost of courses leading up to the GSE.  As I mentioned before, mentoring also forces you to learn the material at a much deeper level so that you can explain the concepts clearly to your students.
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Valkyrja
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« Reply #27 on: October 20, 2010, 04:05:38 PM »

Some really good information in here and I am glad I stumbled back into this forum today. Thanks everyone.
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