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Ethical Hacker Community Forums
November 19, 2008, 06:17:19 PM *
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1  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Re: Just signed up on: April 22, 2008, 10:11:41 PM
good job! Smiley how is the exam? ( i am considering doing it one day). as for needing a low-rent EH-hacker, i'll call you if i need one. Wink

Sorry, been away for a while. 
THe exam took me by suprise a little.  I used the "EXAMPREP" book to study for the test and had some outdated training videos.   I was able to get around the requirement for the boot camp since I am involved with network security at work. 

As for the test itself, I can only recommend that you have a strong grasp on TCP/IP and I was suprised at the amount of questions that require that you know web application attacks.  (SQL injection, cross site scripting, etc)  I also had a tough time with questions that had to do with log files and what an attack would look like to an admin.     Everything else was pretty much straight forward questions regarding multiple choice.   

I had some mixed thoughts about the C|EH exam.   I should have gave it a bit more respect because for some reason I kept thinking that I was studying to the level of "script kiddie" as the exam training seems to be based around all the open source tools on the Internet.

That was until I took the exam and they really got into command line syntax and net apps attack code.   I wasn't ready for it and it almost caused me to fail the test.    If you have a strong knowledge of attacking web applications and get the concepts and tools they are teaching you should do well on the test. 

Just a little about my background, I've been in the IT industry over 15 years, most of it working as a sys admin for the US Army,  the last several years I have been doing patch management and vulnerability testing.   I am security+,Network+, CCNA certified and now C|EH.   
I don't think I could have passed this test prior to getting the CCNA.  I don't think it's a prerequisite but you really need to have a strong grasp on TCP/IP, TCP/UDP ports, TCP/UDP/ICMP flags and headers. 

Hope that helps.         
2  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Re: Just signed up on: March 19, 2008, 10:52:49 PM
I just passed the exam today

Now I just need to find work!

Anybody need a low rent ehtical hacker for hire?
3  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Re: Just signed up on: March 16, 2008, 02:59:28 PM
Thanks for the response and advice - my past VA experience is as a DoD contractor and yes that is the security team.  It is mostly reactive/preventative.  Have been doing it for a while however, it is not in our contract to provide pentesting services and the interesting thing is it is a bit taboo to mention it.  In fact in all the training the Army provides we aren't allowed to have any kind of offensive capability what so ever.   Most of the IT team (especially the security team)  consider the network certification guys who do the pen testing as the bad guy in a way.  (although they won't say it out loud their attitude shift says enough - people got real nervous!)

After reading some of your blog I see how and why the pentester isn't a welcome site for the IT team.  Whenever the network certification guys came around it was a bit hostile for them.   Anyway, thanks again for your help.   

4  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Re: Just signed up on: March 16, 2008, 01:35:28 AM
My big question is how to get a job pentesting?  Job notices on Monster.com for this sort of thing seem to be a bit light...

First of all, thanks for taking the time to lay this out.  And thanks for hitting on pretty much all of my weak areas.  I'm familliar with getting around a Windows based NOS and Cisco networks but never looked at them from the "outside in" or from the hackers viewpoint.  I know about the weaknesses of these systems and know how to mitigate fixing them.  However, I never went as far as learning what those exploits were and knowing how to deploy them.  This is new turf for me. 

With that, I hope you don't mind me asking a few more questions?

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we're full, go try something else.

just kidding
I've been around long enough to know that in all humor there is a hint of truth.  I can imagine the field is tight because I can't imagine many IT staffers hiring 3rd parties to break into their systems.  I for one am not that willing to learn about my incompetence.  (Lots of big egos in the IT backend world.) I imagine that those who hire a team are not usually the IT directors does this = true?

I can imagine that the marketing for a pentest is not mature yet as this seems to be a evolving market. THerefore, not many CEO's are aware of the benefits or even the service.   Is that also true?   This would equate to a small and tight job market for pentesting I would imagine. 

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in all seriousness, the CEH != penetration tester. 

Thanks - how do I market myself once I pass the exam?

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i'm sure i forgot a bunch of things but thats a start.  Also be prepared to not make the money like people used to doing it.  with the prevalence of "hey i passed my CEH now i'm going to go be a pentester  and people working for peanuts sometimes people that have some of those skills dont necessarily get paid according to their knowledge and ability level. 

What does the payscale look like? 

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pentesting isnt like running nessus with credentials or the scanner of the month. you've got usually 3-10 days to find the one thing that the old you missed or forgot to do.  its a different mindset.  i dont know you, so i'm not saying you dont have it, but it is something to keep in mind.  most of the guys we have doing the VA work arent real good at or interested in doing the piece that we do.
I understand, although I have a VA background it's not where I want to stay.     

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advice for getting in, if you are sure you want to do this, really sure, be prepared to a take a junior role and get mentored and use that time to work on your skills. how much that "junior role" pays will depend alot on your skills and where you live.  do your best to find a place that has people alot better than you to learn from get your X number of years of experience and hopefully move on to more $$ and different types of networks/apps to audit.
Excellent advice
Do you usually work "piece meal" or sit on a list waiting to be picked up on a job like a mercenary or something?    Are you employed full time with benefits or are you contracted? i.e 1099 etc.    I have a family to take care of so would I need another source of income during the "slow" months? 

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hope that helps



Great help, and don't mind my screen name - I have to do things like that to keep myself from getting "too" serious sometimes.   
5  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Re: Just signed up on: March 15, 2008, 12:57:38 AM
I have to add that just looking at the broad spectrum of topics on the CEH is pretty intimidating.   The rabbit hole goes pretty deep (not a reference to the Matrix)   Do you guys who do this for a living have a specialty or does youre employer expect you to be a full expert in all areas?   I see the CEH as more of a "frame work"  to begin building advanced skills from.  Is that an accurate assessment?
6  Ethical Hacking Discussions and Related Certifications / Certification / Just signed up on: March 15, 2008, 12:02:40 AM
Greetings.
I just wanted to drop a note and say hi.  I just signed on here after finding the site doing some research for the CEH exam.   I'm scheduled to take it on 3/19.   I'm looking forward to talkign with you folks so here is a little about me.  I've been in the IT biz for over 15 years.  The last 10 being part of the IT staff for a large corporate network.  My primary duties were vulnerability assessment and patch management.    I recently passed the CCNA, net+ and sec+ in 2007 and am very interested in going further into the pentest side of things.   
My big question is how to get a job pentesting?  Job notices on Monster.com for this sort of thing seem to be a bit light...
Anyway,  thanks for having this site up and I'll be digging through it in time.
~Peace
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